Health Bill Summary

[Owen Densmore]

Given that the just-passed health bill is huge, I went looking for a  
summary.  This appears reasonably complete, at least in the aims of  
the bill:
   http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/hr3200_summary.pdf

Any other good summary appreciated!

One question: does anyone understand why health insurance is state-
based?  I.e. if you move to a new state, you have to get new insurance  
based on that state's insurance providers, and not all providers sell  
in particular states.

     -- Owen



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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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[Nick Thompson]

Hi, Owen,

What is described here is the House Bill.  What just passed doesn't, for
instance, have a public option, although it may have a trojan horse.

Publicly chartered co-operatives???

N

Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology,
Clark University ([hidden email])
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
http://www.cusf.org [City University of Santa Fe]

> [Original Message]
> From: Owen Densmore <[hidden email]>
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
> Date: 12/24/2009 10:26:18 AM
> Subject: [FRIAM] Health Bill Summary
>
> Given that the just-passed health bill is huge, I went looking for a  
> summary.  This appears reasonably complete, at least in the aims of  
> the bill:
>    http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/hr3200_summary.pdf
>
> Any other good summary appreciated!
>
> One question: does anyone understand why health insurance is state-
> based?  I.e. if you move to a new state, you have to get new insurance  
> based on that state's insurance providers, and not all providers sell  
> in particular states.
>
>      -- Owen
>
>
>
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

[Owen Densmore]

Sigh, sorry for the house bill rather than the senate.

Here is something that may be useful, not sure .. its a Kaiser site,  
thus has a bias:
   http://www.kff.org/healthreform/sidebyside.cfm

I think we'll have to wait a while for something as clear as the house  
bill's summary.  Heck.

     -- Owen


On Dec 24, 2009, at 11:45 AM, Nicholas Thompson wrote:

> Hi, Owen,
>
> What is described here is the House Bill.  What just passed doesn't,  
> for
> instance, have a public option, although it may have a trojan horse.
>
> Publicly chartered co-operatives???
>
> N
>
> Nicholas S. Thompson
> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology,
> Clark University ([hidden email])
> http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
> http://www.cusf.org [City University of Santa Fe]
>
>
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Owen Densmore <[hidden email]>
>> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]
>> >
>> Date: 12/24/2009 10:26:18 AM
>> Subject: [FRIAM] Health Bill Summary
>>
>> Given that the just-passed health bill is huge, I went looking for a
>> summary.  This appears reasonably complete, at least in the aims of
>> the bill:
>>   http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/hr3200_summary.pdf
>>
>> Any other good summary appreciated!
>>
>> One question: does anyone understand why health insurance is state-
>> based?  I.e. if you move to a new state, you have to get new  
>> insurance
>> based on that state's insurance providers, and not all providers sell
>> in particular states.
>>
>>     -- Owen
>>
>>
>>
>> ============================================================
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
>
>
>
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

[John Kennison]

There is much I don't like about the two healthcare bills, and I fear that the compromise package will not work well (Compromises that make good sense politically  often fail to make sense economically --as in the cartoon of two congressmen making a deal: "Okay, then it's agreed, I'll vote for your appropriation bill and you'll support my tax cut.")

But working through states might be a good idea. Maybe one state will find an effective way to manage the insurers and other states will copy.

________________________________________
From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Owen Densmore [[hidden email]]
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 12:26 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
Subject: [FRIAM] Health Bill Summary

Given that the just-passed health bill is huge, I went looking for a
summary.  This appears reasonably complete, at least in the aims of
the bill:
   http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/hr3200_summary.pdf

Any other good summary appreciated!

One question: does anyone understand why health insurance is state-
based?  I.e. if you move to a new state, you have to get new insurance
based on that state's insurance providers, and not all providers sell
in particular states.

     -- Owen



============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

[Russell Gonnering]

Does anyone else find is strange that two 2,000 page bills, which nobody seems to understand, have been put forward to deal with health care, which is the ultimate Complex Adaptive System?  It strikes me as the antithesis of what was done in "Boids" to produce the flocking/schooling behavior of animals with three simple principles.

David Snowden (www.cognitive-edge.com) developed the Cynefin Matrix to guide decision making based upon cause/effect.  The imposed order of these health care bills are appropriate for simple systems, or possibly even complicated systems.  However, when such an attempt is made to impose order on a complex adaptive system, it pushes the system into chaos.

This will be an interesting, though extremely costly, experiment to test his hypothesis prospectively.

Russ Gonnering

Russell S. Gonnering, MD, FACS, MMM, CPHQ

[hidden email]

On Dec 24, 2009, at 3:09 PM, John Kennison wrote:

There is much I don't like about the two healthcare bills, and I fear that the compromise package will not work well (Compromises that make good sense politically  often fail to make sense economically --as in the cartoon of two congressmen making a deal: "Okay, then it's agreed, I'll vote for your appropriation bill and you'll support my tax cut.")

But working through states might be a good idea. Maybe one state will find an effective way to manage the insurers and other states will copy.

________________________________________
From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Owen Densmore [[hidden email]]
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 12:26 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
Subject: [FRIAM] Health Bill Summary

Given that the just-passed health bill is huge, I went looking for a
summary.  This appears reasonably complete, at least in the aims of
the bill:
  http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/hr3200_summary.pdf

Any other good summary appreciated!

One question: does anyone understand why health insurance is state-
based?  I.e. if you move to a new state, you have to get new insurance
based on that state's insurance providers, and not all providers sell
in particular states.

    -- Owen



============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

Russell S. Gonnering, MD, FACS, MMM, CPHQ

[hidden email]

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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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[Owen Densmore]

NPR has several stories from multiple points of view:
- Hospitals
- Doctors
- Worker's Union
- Now what
- History
- etc
   http://www.npr.org/search/index.php?searchinput=health+bill+summary

    -- Owen


============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org