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Draft abstract

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Russ Abbott

Draft abstract

Hi all,

I'm planning to submit an abstract to this conference. All they want is (a) a short abstract (< 200 words) and a long abstract (< 1000 words including references). Here's my draft. Comments/suggested improvements would be appreciated.

Thanks.

-- Russ Abbott
Professor, Computer Science
California State University, Los Angeles

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Merle Lefkoff-2

Re: Draft abstract

Russ, thanks so much for this. As a social scientist writing about the phenomenal success of recent non-violent resistance movements, I have a particular interest in self-organizing systems at all scale and what kinds of "traces" might amplify mass social action.

On Sat, Mar 20, 2021 at 12:23 PM Russ Abbott <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi all,

I'm planning to submit an abstract to this conference. All they want is (a) a short abstract (< 200 words) and a long abstract (< 1000 words including references). Here's my draft. Comments/suggested improvements would be appreciated.

Thanks.

-- Russ Abbott
Professor, Computer Science
California State University, Los Angeles
- .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. .
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Merle Lefkoff, Ph.D.
Center for Emergent Diplomacy
emergentdiplomacy.org

Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

mobile: (303) 859-5609
skype: merle.lelfkoff2

twitter: @merle110

Jochen Fromm-5

Re: Draft abstract

In reply to this post by Russ Abbott

The idea of "autonomous causation" reminds me of our recent discussions about "free will". A red traffic light causes cars to stop but drivers can refuse to stop if they do not want to stop. They have the autonomy to break the chain of causality. If you want to go in this direction you can cite Daniel Dennett's new book "Just Deserts: Debating Free Will"
https://www.wiley.com/en-us/Just+Deserts%3A+Debating+Free+Will-p-9781509545759

For stigmergy in general I would recommend the work of Guy Theraulaz. His book "Swarm Intelligence: From Natural to Artificial Systems" is a classic. Do you know the books from Mark Moffett: "The human swarm" and "Adventures among ants" ? He is a scholar of E.O. Wilson and argues that symbols and markers are important to identify a social group.
https://3quarksdaily.com/3quarksdaily/2020/01/of-ants-and-humans-some-principles-of-social-organization.html

Symbols can also be used to identify a product. They have causal effects for example if they represent a brand. Brands increase the probability that a consumer recognizes and buys products of a certain brand. They distort perceptions by leaving invisible traces in our brains (for instance by linking certain products to certain attributes or emotions). Given the hype about AI and deep learning, one could ask if such adaptive systems can be manipulated by marketing techniques just like we are seduced by them.

Good luck for your paper!

-J.

-------- Original message --------

From: Russ Abbott <[hidden email]>

Date: 3/20/21 19:51 (GMT+01:00)

To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>

Subject: [FRIAM] Draft abstract

Hi all,

Thanks.

-- Russ Abbott
Professor, Computer Science
California State University, Los Angeles

Russ Abbott

Re: Draft abstract

In reply to this post by Russ Abbott

Thanks, Jochen. Two very interesting books.

The Amazon reviews of the Dennett-Caruso book range from 1 star to 5 stars! The Amazon blurb on the book puts the focus on the implications of one's views about Free Will for moral responsibility.

"Dennett argues that the kind of free will required for moral responsibility is compatible with determinism – for him, self-control is key; we are not responsible for becoming responsible, but are responsible for staying responsible, for keeping would-be puppeteers at bay. Caruso takes the opposite view, arguing that who we are and what we do is ultimately the result of factors beyond our control, and because of this we are never morally responsible for our actions in the sense that would make us truly deserving of blame and praise, punishment and reward." Undoubtedly an interesting discussion.

My concern is much less about moral responsibility than theirs. Moral responsibility adds an additional layer to the discussion that makes everything much muddier.

I once knew a very intelligent determinist who argued that punishment was important nevertheless. It plays the same role as training for neural nets. Even though the neural net mechanism is deterministic, it's useless without training. Punishment, and more generally child-rearing and education serve the same function for society. They make humans much more valuable members. All that is fully compatible with determinism.

-- Russ Abbott
Professor, Computer Science
California State University, Los Angeles

On Sat, Mar 20, 2021 at 2:41 PM Jochen Fromm <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea of "autonomous causation" reminds me of our recent discussions about "free will". A red traffic light causes cars to stop but drivers can refuse to stop if they do not want to stop. They have the autonomy to break the chain of causality. If you want to go in this direction you can cite Daniel Dennett's new book "Just Deserts: Debating Free Will"
https://www.wiley.com/en-us/Just+Deserts%3A+Debating+Free+Will-p-9781509545759

For stigmergy in general I would recommend the work of Guy Theraulaz. His book "Swarm Intelligence: From Natural to Artificial Systems" is a classic. Do you know the books from Mark Moffett: "The human swarm" and "Adventures among ants" ? He is a scholar of E.O. Wilson and argues that symbols and markers are important to identify a social group.
https://3quarksdaily.com/3quarksdaily/2020/01/of-ants-and-humans-some-principles-of-social-organization.html

Symbols can also be used to identify a product. They have causal effects for example if they represent a brand. Brands increase the probability that a consumer recognizes and buys products of a certain brand. They distort perceptions by leaving invisible traces in our brains (for instance by linking certain products to certain attributes or emotions). Given the hype about AI and deep learning, one could ask if such adaptive systems can be manipulated by marketing techniques just like we are seduced by them.

Good luck for your paper!

-J.

-------- Original message --------
From: Russ Abbott <[hidden email]>
Date: 3/20/21 19:51 (GMT+01:00)
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
Subject: [FRIAM] Draft abstract

Hi all,

I'm planning to submit an abstract to this conference. All they want is (a) a short abstract (< 200 words) and a long abstract (< 1000 words including references). Here's my draft. Comments/suggested improvements would be appreciated.

Thanks.

-- Russ Abbott
Professor, Computer Science
California State University, Los Angeles

Marcus G. Daniels

Re: Draft abstract

< I once knew a very intelligent determinist who argued that punishment was important nevertheless. It plays the same role as training for neural nets. Even though the neural net mechanism is deterministic, it's useless without training. Punishment, and more generally child-rearing and education serve the same function for society. They make humans much more valuable members. All that is fully compatible with determinism. >

Later in the process the humans may be a bit better, but it couldn’t have been any other way. Or, if one allows for true randomness, it could be many ways, but none of them are controllable.

Marcus

Frank Wimberly-2

Re: Draft abstract

Reminds me of Calvinism. It is predetermined whether you will go to Heaven or Hell but you'd better behave as if it isn't.

---
Frank C. Wimberly
140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
Santa Fe, NM 87505

505 670-9918
Santa Fe, NM

On Sat, Mar 20, 2021, 4:35 PM Marcus Daniels <[hidden email]> wrote:

< I once knew a very intelligent determinist who argued that punishment was important nevertheless. It plays the same role as training for neural nets. Even though the neural net mechanism is deterministic, it's useless without training. Punishment, and more generally child-rearing and education serve the same function for society. They make humans much more valuable members. All that is fully compatible with determinism. >

Later in the process the humans may be a bit better, but it couldn’t have been any other way. Or, if one allows for true randomness, it could be many ways, but none of them are controllable.

Marcus

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Marcus G. Daniels

Re: Draft abstract

If there is true randomness, are the rolls of the dice a surprise to her too?

From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Frank Wimberly
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2021 7:50 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Draft abstract

Reminds me of Calvinism. It is predetermined whether you will go to Heaven or Hell but you'd better behave as if it isn't.

---
Frank C. Wimberly
140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
Santa Fe, NM 87505

505 670-9918
Santa Fe, NM

On Sat, Mar 20, 2021, 4:35 PM Marcus Daniels <[hidden email]> wrote:

< I once knew a very intelligent determinist who argued that punishment was important nevertheless. It plays the same role as training for neural nets. Even though the neural net mechanism is deterministic, it's useless without training. Punishment, and more generally child-rearing and education serve the same function for society. They make humans much more valuable members. All that is fully compatible with determinism. >

Later in the process the humans may be a bit better, but it couldn’t have been any other way. Or, if one allows for true randomness, it could be many ways, but none of them are controllable.

Marcus

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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
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