Posted by
Marcus G. Daniels on
Jan 27, 2021; 10:17pm
URL: http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/Acronyms-tp7600393p7600475.html
One can navigate some moderation by structuring arguments in pieces, leaving it to the reader to fill in some dots. In crude form, we saw that with Trump and the riots. (I recall you argued he wouldn't be convicted in a court of law.)
One can call this self-censorship, but it is also self-control. The kind of self-control that rioters lacked is a good thing to incentivize; it is useful to let those without self-control get nabbed; they are plainly dangerous.
“People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use.” ― Søren Kierkegaard
-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <
[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 11:22 AM
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Acronyms
The particular thing Dave cited <
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_230> follows nicely with our discussion of forcing a *format* for posts. If it's eliminated or changed such that the hosts of redfish.com become responsible for the posts, then that changes the game quite a bit.
From my interpretation of EricS' part, it's not a bad thing to rely on implicit structure in judging content. So removing 230 would make redfish.com more like a traditional medium that has to take some responsibility for posts. And even strict moderation can be justified, if only based on principles of kindness and people as ends in themselves.
From my interpretation of Dave's part, if only deeply resourced agents can *afford* to publish controversial things, then that feeds the oligarchy and risks all the authoritarian circumstances we're afraid of. Even with 230, there are libel laws, revenge porn laws, hate speech laws, etc. that restrict what we can post. But without 230, it would be fairly easy for someone who doesn't like one of us oft-posting blowhards to get redfish.com shut down.
I'm not at all concerned with what happens to the individual sh¡tposter. I *am* concerned what happens to the infrastructure on which the sh¡tposter posts. It's an important debate crossing lots of domains and with both practical and ideal issues. It's fine if we don't want to have the debate. But it's myopic to cartoon it away.
On 1/27/21 10:57 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
> I guess I can see why you’d say that. However, I’d argue there is
> still social behavior, even honesty and trust, in a world where information is exchanged in a very cautious way. In the world that I guess Dave is afraid of, people that mouth off too have bad outcomes. Maybe that policing is not so bad?
>
>
>
> *From:* Friam <
[hidden email]> *On Behalf Of
> *
[hidden email]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 27, 2021 9:10 AM
> *To:* 'The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group'
> <
[hidden email]>
> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Acronyms
>
>
>
> Marcus,
>
>
>
> The position you take seems to be radical individualism, i.e., that
> there is a me that exists and can be revealed by stripping away the constraints of any social contact. The contrasting view is that “me” is inevitably social, and that it is revealed only by social interaction. So the stable me, the naked me, is actually a fiction, or at most, a statistical average.
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