Re: the arc of ai (was Re: Whew!)

Posted by Marcus G. Daniels on
URL: http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/Whew-tp7589583p7589612.html

Frank writes:

"I mentioned that my wife, who went to graduate school at the Harvard Ed School, is a big proponent of pre-K.  Merle said that I missed the point and that Jeff Skilling and Jared Kushner's father also went to Harvard.  I said that Ted K went to Berkeley to make the case that having alumni in prison is irrelevant. "

As to the question of whether or not argument from authority is appropriate, I had concluded from your original remark that you think is.  But, I guess, that some exceptions are to be expected like Skilling and Kaczynski.   Maybe so.

Another point of view is that while argument from authority is pervasive, even in intellectual circles, it is the kind of thinking that puts group loyalty over rationality and trust over truth. 

Marcus 

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From: Friam <[hidden email]> on behalf of Frank Wimberly <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, May 6, 2017 9:44:59 AM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] the arc of ai (was Re: Whew!)

 

Let's summarize.  I said I wish people would focus on the benefits of pre-K education rather than the economic impacts of the tax and the effects on diet.  I mentioned that my wife, who went to graduate school at the Harvard Ed School, is a big proponent of pre-K.  Merle said that I missed the point and that Jeff Skilling and Jared Kushner's father also went to Harvard.  I said that Ted K went to Berkeley to make the case that having alumni in prison is irrelevant.  Merle says it's not.

My wife hates being mentioned in this context. Let me tell you a little more.  When she was at Harvard she worked with Jonathan Kozol to improve educational opportunities for Puerto Rican toddlers in South Boston.  In Pittsburgh she worked in a therapeutic Headstart program as head teacher to offer pre-K education to high risk kids whose mothers were schizophrenic. They were 3-4 years old and at least one of them witnessed the murder of her mother. They were mostly African American and arrived at school very hungry.  They ate at school.  This was done under the auspices of the University of Pittsburgh Psychiatry Department.  There's more but...

Frank 

On May 6, 2017 9:15 AM, "Marcus Daniels" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Frank writes:

"Which notorious person went to which university?  Why?"

It’s a question of fairness and consistency relative to values, not a question of correct vs. incorrect.

 

Here are two more personal experiences which I doubt I really need to give but I will for completeness. 

1. A disruptive technology is reported in a peer-reviewed journal which I argue is worth considering.   I provide background (cited papers), and my colleague skims over the affiliations over the authors of those papers rather than reading the abstracts.

2. Our team arranges a meeting with a possible funding source and have a pitch prepared with preliminary results and working prototype code.    First thing the person does is flip to the section with the staff bios to see which universities they attended. 

I could give many more examples of this kind of authority-based selection that I see every day.   I'm not arguing that there is nothing to this approach, or that it is complete ineffectual.   It depends on what the deciders are optimizing for.   One thing they could be optimizing is to ensure their collaborators are presentable and demonstrate a baseline of intelligence, and certain breadth and depth of knowledge.  

However, when such a person that otherwise would passes muster, puts out a document that starts from fairly common premises to surprising conclusions, that chain of reasoning might be subject to consideration.  Sure, if there is more context, like knowing in retrospect that the person was guilty of murder, then that may or may not cause them to discard consideration of the argument.    For me, it makes me more interested in understanding the motives and reasoning and to make sure I convince myself I have an idea of where they lost it.

Marcus

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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove