> But we may have to have a useful conversation about emergence in
> order to talk about soul, consciousness, or spirit.
>
> Merle
>
>
>
>
> Nicholas Thompson wrote:
>> Try this: a property of an entity is emergent when it depends on
>> the arrangment or the order of presentation of the parts of the
>> entity. (It's /properties/ that are emergent, not /entities/ ...
>> some properties of a pile of sand are emergent, some aggregate.)
>> Here, I believe, I am channeling Wimsatt. The beauty of reading a
>> collection such as Bedau and The Other Guy is that you experience
>> the whip-lash of moving from point of view to point of view. Good
>> exercise for the neck. By the way, Russ (was it?) was
>> a ...leetle... unfair to Bedau. I dont think Bedau thinks it's a
>> mystery; i think he thinks others have thought it a mystery. But
>> it's been a few months since I read it. Implementation: Consider
>> the expression, "there is more than one way to skin a cat".
>> Equivalent to: "there are several programs you can use to implement
>> a cat skinning." Consciousness: the big source of confusion in
>> emergence discussions is the attempt to attach emergence to such
>> perennial mysteries as consciousness. (Actually, I dont think
>> consciousness is a mystery, but let that go.) The strength of a
>> triangle is an emergent property of the arrangment of its legs and
>> their attachments. There are lots of ways bang together boards
>> and still have a weak construction, which I learned when I put
>> together a grape arbor with no diagonal members. Worked fine until
>> the grapes grew on it. Emergent properties are everywhere in the
>> simplest of constructions. We dont need to talk about soul, or
>> consciouness, or spirit to have a useful conversation about
>> emergence.
>> Nick
>> Nicholas S. Thompson
>> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology,
>> Clark University (
[hidden email] <mailto:
[hidden email]>)
>>
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ <
http://home.earthlink.net/%7Enickthompson/naturaldesigns/
>> >
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Victoria Hughes <mailto:
[hidden email]>
>> *To: *The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
>> <mailto:
[hidden email]>
>> *Sent:* 9/6/2009 10:32:59 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] emergence
>>
>> Consciousness / self-awareness?
>> Is this thus acceptable as an emergent phenomenon?
>> If so, how does this permit, or not, the definition of 'the self'
>> as a unique identity?
>>
>>> Emergence is what happens when components of the "emergent
>>> entity" act in such a way as to bring about the existence and
>>> persistence of that entity.
>>>
>>> When "boids" follow their local flying rules, they create
>>> (implement) a flock. It's not mysterious. We know how it works.
>>>
>>> That's all emergence is: coordinated or consistent actions among
>>> a number of elements that result in the formation and persistence
>>> of some aggregate entity or phenomenon.
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
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>
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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http://www.friam.org>
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College