speaking of drugs
Locked
 
|
Belgian woman dies after taking sip of MDMA-laced wine
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/27/belgian-woman-dies-after-taking-sip-of-mdma-laced-wine I've succumbed to fake news before. I can't find the article, but there was some hype by some startup chip maker claiming some outrageous computational speed. I fell for it. My optimism beat out my doubt. Since that very embarrassing episode, before I ever even dreamed an empty Celebrity like Trump would benefit from Russian disinformation campaigns, I've been pretty suspicious of any news, especially anything coming out of Silly Valley. Given that, I can't help but wonder about the above article. MDMA isn't as safe as psilocybin or LSD. But it's relatively safe. Transporting concentrated mdma in wine bottles seems like a risky move for a drug trafficker. If it was concentrated enough to kill her after only a "little sip", somebody's head should roll within the trafficker's value chain. But, then again, anyone who combines "100% against drugs" with the consumption of wine probably can't be trusted to be accurate about how big a "sip" she really had. Of course, this is yet another reason to make your own beer/wine/cider at your house ... thank you Jimmy Carter! Spirits are a different thing, though. Back in PDX, a bunch of friends brought their homemade whiskies, vodkas, and whatnot to a ping-pong party, happily trusting each other to have done it right ... That's a big "No thank you, man" for me. Give me the wisdom of the microbes over distillation tech any day of the week. -- ☣ uǝlƃ ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
|
|
I would discount the story. MDMA is not directly toxic. People die from the side-effects - overheating (especially the brain) and dehydration. Do not take MDMA in pill form - the ingredients used to bind and cut the pure stuff can obviously be dangerous. I use pure crystals and cannot imagine any possibility that any diluted residue could add up to a dose, and if the concentrate were still in the wine it could be detected and it still wouldn't have much effect unless you had as much as half a glass.
davew On Thu, Feb 27, 2020, at 5:46 PM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > Belgian woman dies after taking sip of MDMA-laced wine > https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/27/belgian-woman-dies-after-taking-sip-of-mdma-laced-wine > > I've succumbed to fake news before. I can't find the article, but there > was some hype by some startup chip maker claiming some outrageous > computational speed. I fell for it. My optimism beat out my doubt. > Since that very embarrassing episode, before I ever even dreamed an > empty Celebrity like Trump would benefit from Russian disinformation > campaigns, I've been pretty suspicious of any news, especially anything > coming out of Silly Valley. > > Given that, I can't help but wonder about the above article. MDMA isn't > as safe as psilocybin or LSD. But it's relatively safe. Transporting > concentrated mdma in wine bottles seems like a risky move for a drug > trafficker. If it was concentrated enough to kill her after only a > "little sip", somebody's head should roll within the trafficker's value > chain. But, then again, anyone who combines "100% against drugs" with > the consumption of wine probably can't be trusted to be accurate about > how big a "sip" she really had. > > Of course, this is yet another reason to make your own beer/wine/cider > at your house ... thank you Jimmy Carter! Spirits are a different > thing, though. Back in PDX, a bunch of friends brought their homemade > whiskies, vodkas, and whatnot to a ping-pong party, happily trusting > each other to have done it right ... That's a big "No thank you, man" > for me. Give me the wisdom of the microbes over distillation tech any > day of the week. > > -- > ☣ uǝlƃ > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove > ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
|
|
I picked out the following for examination. But, then again, anyone who combines "100% > against drugs" with the consumption of wine probably can't be trusted As the person designated in this argument to be against drugs, I have to confess to drinking an occasional glass of wine. And one bourbon eggnog at Christmas. Nobody ever claimed for alcohol that it brought me to a new reality or raised one to a higher state of understanding. I think of it as inducing a modulated and reversible little death of the mind, a quieting of the voice. Not so much an altered state, as a slowed regular state. It is evidently destructive, but sometimes a little destruction is just what one needs. Does this vitiate my puritan credentials? Yes. Almost certainly. I wouldn’t trust me either. Particularly after the bourbon. Nick Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -----Original Message----- I would discount the story. MDMA is not directly toxic. People die from the side-effects - overheating (especially the brain) and dehydration. Do not take MDMA in pill form - the ingredients used to bind and cut the pure stuff can obviously be dangerous. I use pure crystals and cannot imagine any possibility that any diluted residue could add up to a dose, and if the concentrate were still in the wine it could be detected and it still wouldn't have much effect unless you had as much as half a glass. davew On Thu, Feb 27, 2020, at 5:46 PM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > Belgian woman dies after taking sip of MDMA-laced wine > https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/27/belgian-woman-dies-after > -taking-sip-of-mdma-laced-wine > > I've succumbed to fake news before. I can't find the article, but > there was some hype by some startup chip maker claiming some > outrageous computational speed. I fell for it. My optimism beat out my doubt. > Since that very embarrassing episode, before I ever even dreamed an > empty Celebrity like Trump would benefit from Russian disinformation > campaigns, I've been pretty suspicious of any news, especially > anything coming out of Silly Valley. > > Given that, I can't help but wonder about the above article. MDMA > isn't as safe as psilocybin or LSD. But it's relatively safe. > Transporting concentrated mdma in wine bottles seems like a risky move > for a drug trafficker. If it was concentrated enough to kill her after > only a "little sip", somebody's head should roll within the > trafficker's value chain. But, then again, anyone who combines "100% > against drugs" with the consumption of wine probably can't be trusted > to be accurate about how big a "sip" she really had. > > Of course, this is yet another reason to make your own beer/wine/cider > at your house ... thank you Jimmy Carter! Spirits are a different > thing, though. Back in PDX, a bunch of friends brought their homemade > whiskies, vodkas, and whatnot to a ping-pong party, happily trusting > each other to have done it right ... That's a big "No thank you, man" > for me. Give me the wisdom of the microbes over distillation tech any > day of the week. > > -- > ☣ uǝlƃ > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe > at St. John's College to unsubscribe > http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove > ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
|
|
I claimed *exactly* that a few posts ago ... well, OK. I suppose you have to read a little between the lines to see it. That your between sober and drunken life is *false*, starts us down the slippery slope to claiming that alcohol *does* bring you to a new reality and raises your consciousness. I can continue that argument if need be.
I don't much care if you believe it or not. But what I do want you to hear is that any insight one thinks they gain while on drug X is *already* reachable, sober, drunk, calcium deficient, high on tryptophan, or whatever. You're right to question the claims to insight the druggies make. But you're wrong to distinguish so harshly between states. Your privileging sober life is almost a perfect analogy to the Cartesian split between mind and body. Just because 1 state *feels* one way and another feels another way doesn't imply they're different in kind, however much they may differ in degree. And if you're unclear on the prejudicial consequences of such a false dichotomy, all you need do is look at our (admitted) *need* for the disease model of addiction ... or if that's not enough data, take a look at the demographics of our prison population (black vs. white, poor vs. wealthy, etc.). As to the destructiveness of an altered state, "the dosage is the poison". A tiny bit of sky diving is just fine. Too much sky diving will kill you. On 2/27/20 9:11 AM, [hidden email] wrote: > Nobody ever claimed for alcohol that it brought me to a new reality or raised one to a higher state of understanding. I think of it as inducing a modulated and reversible little death of the mind, a quieting of the voice. Not so much an altered state, as a slowed regular state. It is evidently destructive, but sometimes a little destruction is just what one needs. -- ☣ uǝlƃ ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
|
|
|
Only tangentially related, but I was very struck by the discussion of the “empathy gap” in a recent Hidden Brain podcast (links below). The empathy gap was described as we aren’t really even able to understand or predict our own decision making process when we are in a different “state” from that in which we would be making the decision. I wonder if armed with the idea of the empathy gap there is a way to take advantage of these different people we become when in different states and if this relates to the different states we can reach through drugs or other means. I.e. we could focus group a decision (for insight) by considering it in many different states. —joshua
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
|
|
Very nice links! I also wonder if Wim Hoff hyperventilating and the borderline pseudoscience stuff surrounding the vagus nerve are relevant, here. There's data surrounding chronic pain that suggest a familiarity with pain, reduces its prevalence. I *believe* (but haven't looked into it), that it's not merely habituation to the pain. I think the mobility fosters some mechanistic processes that reduce both the pain and its causes.
When I used to run long distances, I never really experienced a recognizable "runner's high". But I did go into something like fugue states that may be akin to a psychedelic. Sometimes I'd come out of the run with a solution to a work problem. But there was also a period where I began to believe in magic/witchcraft. I was running like 6 miles per weekday and longer on the weekend days. That feeling/belief faded drastically later in the day (I work out fasted in the mornings) and disappeared completely if I skipped a day. My "sober" self later in the day literally (yes, literally) scoffed at the silly beliefs of my running self. Despite that story, I think you're onto something with the parallax. Tools (phone apps, sticky notes, etc.) that help remind one of issues/objectives/problems while in multiple various states might be interesting. On 2/27/20 11:16 AM, [hidden email] wrote: > Only tangentially related, but I was very struck by the discussion of the “empathy gap” in a recent Hidden Brain podcast (links below). The empathy gap was described as we aren’t really even able to understand or predict our own decision making process when we are in a different “state” from that in which we would be making the decision. > > I wonder if armed with the idea of the empathy gap there is a way to take advantage of these different people we become when in different states and if this relates to the different states we can reach through drugs or other means. I.e. we could focus group a decision (for insight) by considering it in many different states. > > https://thedecisionlab.com/biases/empathy-gap/ > https://www.npr.org/2019/11/27/783495595/in-the-heat-of-the-moment-how-intense-emotions-transform-us -- ☣ uǝlƃ ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
|
| Free forum by Nabble | Edit this page |