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Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
 
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The abundance of online discussions about WikiLeaks, has provoked me to
recall a conversation I had with an individual at an 'Internetworking' meeting at the Carnegie Inst. in DC, in 1992. We met for the first time, and quickly shared our interest in 'information warfare'. Though he could not tell me what he did for a living, it was clear that he was a civilian involved with military intelligence (DIA). I mentioned recent past (Glasnost / Perestroika) conversations I'd had with other 'intelligence' agents, including former Soviet officials. Bob told me that US/UK and the USSR secrecy practices of the Cold War, had resulted in two to three generations of secrecy, deception and obfuscation, which had cumulatively permeated all sectors of the intelligence community; to the point that internally, agencies could no longer function effectively. We were all lying to ourselves , as well as to our enemies. A new strategy was determined by all. We could no longer keep secrets from our enemies, so we would overwhelm them with 'information overload'. Too much raw and unprocessed (un-vetted) information would mire our enemies in confusion and uncertainty. In a networked local-global society, this would also permeate throughout our own society; a top-down, best-practice for controlling large, diverse, contentious and 'well informed' populations; the unruly democratic mob. A few months earlier (pre-web 1991), immediately following the brief Gulf War, through a source at the Pentagon, I received and then released video to ABC News of recent, secret 'friendly fire' incidents that occurred during that conflict. It went viral. I'll save my story for another time, about the redacted web-art project: www.nationalsecuritytesting.info RL ------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Lowenberg P. O. Box 8001, Santa Fe, NM 87504 505-989-9110 off.; 505-603-5200 cell ------------------------------------------------------------------- 1st-Mile Institute, a program of Santa Fe Complex New Mexico 'Broadband for All' Initiative www.1st-mile.com [hidden email] ------------------------------------------------------------------- ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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In reply to this post by Roger Critchlow-2
Ahhhhh! The fatal attraction of paranoia. The illusion that ANYBODY gives a ff what I do. N From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Roger Critchlow Why worry about gmail? Worry about the NSA backdoor that Intel added to the x86 microcode years ago, until you get tired, then go back to your regularly scheduled activities. -- rec -- On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 11:25 AM, Owen Densmore <[hidden email]> wrote: BTW: one concern I've had lately is the large number of folks converting to gmail. What a target for the Feds! And just how much resistance would Google put up? Can you say Zero? ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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In reply to this post by Douglas Roberts-2
Just for the interest, I thought I'd look into how I might do
this. Technically, it'd be very easy - just create an FTP account on my hosted webservice, and set up the extra domain. The problem is that they would get me by the terms of service: "Personal accounts are to be used by the primary owner only. Personal account holders are not permitted resell, store or give away web-hosting services of their web site to other parties. Web hosting services are defined as allowing a separate, third party to host content on the owner's web site. Exceptions to this include ad banners, classified ads, and personal ads. Unlimited-Space.com reserves the right to refuse service and /or access to its servers to anyone." I can see how mirroring Wikileaks could be considered "giving away web-hosting service", which is against the ToS. Secondly, they could also argue that "Unlimited-Space.com do not allow any of the following content to be stored on its servers: Illegal Material - This includes copyrighted works, commercial audio, video, or music files, and any material in violation of any Federal, State or Local regulation." All the Australian government would need to do is classify the wikileak data as illegal, or just invoke copyright on the cables issued by Australian embassies. So alas, I would fold at the first whiff of a fight. But I'm glad to see a lot of other sites offering support already. Maybe torrenting might work better? On Mon, Dec 06, 2010 at 10:32:16AM -0700, Douglas Roberts wrote: > If you want to add your site to the (currently) 507 sites mirroring > WikiLeaks, just follow the instructions here: > > http://www.wikileaks.ch/mass-mirror.html > > --Doug > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Mathematics UNSW SYDNEY 2052 [hidden email] Australia http://www.hpcoders.com.au ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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In reply to this post by Nick Thompson
Ah, the fatal attraction of privilege: the illusion that as long as NOBODY gives a ff what *you* do, everything is OK.
That's not directed at you, Nick, but I couldn't resist the parallel structure.
~~J On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 4:31 PM, Nicholas Thompson <[hidden email]> wrote:
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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G Well, I guess, both are illusions. n From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of James Steiner Ah, the fatal attraction of privilege: the illusion that as long as NOBODY gives a ff what *you* do, everything is OK. That's not directed at you, Nick, but I couldn't resist the parallel structure. ~~J On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 4:31 PM, Nicholas Thompson <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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Administrator
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In reply to this post by Douglas Roberts-2
The Berkman Center for Internet & Society is going to have Larry Lessig and Jonathan Zittrain moderate a discussion .. see more here: http://goo.gl/VFoV9
Feel free to add a topic to the discussion via the url above .. either as a comment or on their twitter account listed there. -- Owen ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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In reply to this post by Douglas Roberts-2
Doug: I've asked the Berkman Center to include a risk assessment for our helping out via the mirroring stunt you posted. Note the mirror list is growing fast:
Wikileaks is currently mirrored on 729 sites (updated 2010-12-06 22:32 GMT) -- Owen On Dec 6, 2010, at 10:32 AM, Douglas Roberts wrote: > If you want to add your site to the (currently) 507 sites mirroring WikiLeaks, just follow the instructions here: > > http://www.wikileaks.ch/mass-mirror.html > > --Doug Begin forwarded message: > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc. > > The Berkman Center for Internet & Society is going to have Larry Lessig and Jonathan Zittrain moderate a discussion .. see more here: http://goo.gl/VFoV9 > > Feel free to add a topic to the discussion via the url above .. either as a comment or on their twitter account listed there. > > -- Owen ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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That's cool, Owen. The US continues to strive, with some success, to make itself out as a nation of idiots/cowards/and/or sheep in the eyes of the rest of the world. Thankfully, there are enough active mirrors to essentially guarantee that the WikiLeaks material won't be lost.
--Doug
On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 6:21 PM, Owen Densmore <[hidden email]> wrote: Doug: I've asked the Berkman Center to include a risk assessment for our helping out via the mirroring stunt you posted. Note the mirror list is growing fast: -- Doug Roberts [hidden email] [hidden email] 505-455-7333 - Office 505-670-8195 - Cell ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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This is an interesting and—IMHO—nicely balanced piece. It's all shades of grey, man -- R
http://www.shirky.com/weblog/2010/12/wikileaks-and-the-long-haul/ ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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In reply to this post by Owen Densmore
On 12/6/10 6:21 PM, Owen Densmore wrote:
> Doug: I've asked the Berkman Center to include a risk assessment for our helping out via the mirroring stunt you posted. Note the mirror list is growing fast: > Wikileaks is currently mirrored on 729 sites (updated 2010-12-06 22:32 GMT) I'm surprised it is only growing linear, not geometric! Do we have a model for that? > -- Owen > > > On Dec 6, 2010, at 10:32 AM, Douglas Roberts wrote: > >> If you want to add your site to the (currently) 507 sites mirroring WikiLeaks, just follow the instructions here: >> >> http://www.wikileaks.ch/mass-mirror.html >> >> --Doug > Begin forwarded message: >> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc. >> >> The Berkman Center for Internet& Society is going to have Larry Lessig and Jonathan Zittrain moderate a discussion .. see more here: http://goo.gl/VFoV9 >> >> Feel free to add a topic to the discussion via the url above .. either as a comment or on their twitter account listed there. >> >> -- Owen > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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On Mon, Dec 06, 2010 at 09:16:03PM -0700, Steve Smith wrote:
> On 12/6/10 6:21 PM, Owen Densmore wrote: > >Doug: I've asked the Berkman Center to include a risk assessment for our helping out via the mirroring stunt you posted. Note the mirror list is growing fast: > > Wikileaks is currently mirrored on 729 sites (updated 2010-12-06 22:32 GMT) > I'm surprised it is only growing linear, not geometric! > Do we have a model for that? > > -- Owen > > > > > >On Dec 6, 2010, at 10:32 AM, Douglas Roberts wrote: > > > >>If you want to add your site to the (currently) 507 sites mirroring WikiLeaks, just follow the instructions here: > >> Only two data points. The only model is the linear one :). -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Mathematics UNSW SYDNEY 2052 [hidden email] Australia http://www.hpcoders.com.au ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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Russell -
I forgot to mention... I've been using Collecta to monitor the real-time traffic since about 9PM GMT-7 on the topic and have a dozen or so data points which are roughly linear... I suppose I might have been the only one tracking at that level... And when I say linear, I often suspect all natural phenomena of sufficient complexity are roughly Sigmoidal... so, the question is really why we aren't still on the (apparently) exponential or geometric portion... a scaling question more likely. - Steve > On Mon, Dec 06, 2010 at 09:16:03PM -0700, Steve Smith wrote: >> On 12/6/10 6:21 PM, Owen Densmore wrote: >>> Doug: I've asked the Berkman Center to include a risk assessment for our helping out via the mirroring stunt you posted. Note the mirror list is growing fast: >>> Wikileaks is currently mirrored on 729 sites (updated 2010-12-06 22:32 GMT) >> I'm surprised it is only growing linear, not geometric! >> Do we have a model for that? >>> -- Owen >>> >>> >>> On Dec 6, 2010, at 10:32 AM, Douglas Roberts wrote: >>> >>>> If you want to add your site to the (currently) 507 sites mirroring WikiLeaks, just follow the instructions here: >>>> > Only two data points. The only model is the linear one :). > ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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Administrator
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In reply to this post by Robert Holmes
On Dec 6, 2010, at 7:18 PM, Robert Holmes wrote:
> This is an interesting and—IMHO—nicely balanced piece. It's all shades of grey, man -- R > > http://www.shirky.com/weblog/2010/12/wikileaks-and-the-long-haul/ Hard to argue with Clay's point that a balance of power, with clear and just laws, define the boundary of freedom of information. But note how he is also clear that we have no such balance, nor reasonable laws. This is the age of populism, from the Tea Party to Libertarianism, to now a free and open (and responsible) internet. I am interested in hearing nuanced discussions. But no longer amongst politicians. Or power brokers and industries. They have lost their place and squandered their right to lead. Its us now. This includes Lessig and Shirky and others of their ilk like Kevin Kelley and Tim O'Reilly; sites like the Edge and TED; organizations like EFF, Berkman and the Creative Commons. And I hope ourselves. But for now, I want to, much like Lessig, understand what our digital rights are, and what they should be. For the latter, we need to start doing things such as building our own networks and services. Like wikileaks mirrors. -- Owen ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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Owen n all,
For me, in the age of Fox news and media consolidation, the benefit of the doubt goes to Wikileaks. Oh, and, by the way: As of Obama's announcement today, I am trolling for a third party. Any suggestions? Nick -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Owen Densmore Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 9:55 PM To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group Subject: Re: [FRIAM] WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc. On Dec 6, 2010, at 7:18 PM, Robert Holmes wrote: > This is an interesting and-IMHO-nicely balanced piece. It's all shades > of grey, man -- R > > http://www.shirky.com/weblog/2010/12/wikileaks-and-the-long-haul/ Hard to argue with Clay's point that a balance of power, with clear and just laws, define the boundary of freedom of information. But note how he is also clear that we have no such balance, nor reasonable laws. This is the age of populism, from the Tea Party to Libertarianism, to now a free and open (and responsible) internet. I am interested in hearing nuanced discussions. But no longer amongst politicians. Or power brokers and industries. They have lost their place and squandered their right to lead. Its us now. This includes Lessig and Shirky and others of their ilk like Kevin Kelley and Tim O'Reilly; sites like the Edge and TED; organizations like EFF, Berkman and the Creative Commons. And I hope ourselves. But for now, I want to, much like Lessig, understand what our digital rights are, and what they should be. For the latter, we need to start doing things such as building our own networks and services. Like wikileaks mirrors. -- Owen ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
Re: WikiLeaks, US Gov't prohibition, Corporate Boycotts, etc.
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Independent.
On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 10:28 PM, Nicholas Thompson <[hidden email]> wrote: Owen n all, -- Doug Roberts [hidden email] [hidden email] 505-455-7333 - Office 505-670-8195 - Cell ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org |
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