Watch Mars landing this afternoon
Locked
Watch Mars landing this afternoon
 
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You can watch the Mars landing live here and on Space.com's homepage, courtesy of NASA, beginning at 2:15 p.m. EST (1915 GMT). The landing is expected at 3:55 p.m. EST (2055 GMT).
TJ ============================================ Tom Johnson - tom@... Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA 505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h) NM Foundation for Open Government Check out It's The People's Data ============================================ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
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OMG, look at all that bureacratic red tape they have to go through. They should just deregulate this process. It would be so much more efficient that way. >8^D
On 2/18/21 11:08 AM, Tom Johnson wrote: > You can watch the Mars landing live here <https://www.cloudhq-mkt9.net/mail_track/link/50101fb0bb3b269f03_1613675396466?uid=226430&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.space.com%2F17933-nasa-television-webcasts-live-space-tv.html> and on Space.com's homepage, courtesy of NASA, beginning at 2:15 p.m. EST (1915 GMT). The landing is expected at 3:55 p.m. EST (2055 GMT). -- ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
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Re: Watch Mars landing this afternoon
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Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an
efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify conceptual tourism? -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
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error: expected ‘=’, ‘,’, ‘;’, ‘asm’ or ‘__attribute__’ at end of input
On 2/18/21 11:37 AM, jon zingale wrote: > Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an > efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify > conceptual tourism? -- ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
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Re: Watch Mars landing this afternoon
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In reply to this post by gepr
Watching the landing on the NASA YouTube channel. Good luck Perseverance! 🚀 https://youtu.be/gm0b_ijaYMQ -J. -------- Original message -------- From: uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ <[hidden email]> Date: 2/18/21 20:30 (GMT+01:00) To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Watch Mars landing this afternoon On 2/18/21 11:08 AM, Tom Johnson wrote: > You can watch the Mars landing live here <https://www.cloudhq-mkt9.net/mail_track/link/50101fb0bb3b269f03_1613675396466?uid=226430&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.space.com%2F17933-nasa-television-webcasts-live-space-tv.html> and on Space.com's homepage, courtesy of NASA, beginning at 2:15 p.m. EST (1915 GMT). The landing is expected at 3:55 p.m. EST (2055 GMT). -- ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
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In reply to this post by gepr
is missing a semicolon (a major clue was the error message "In function
‘Statement’: ...") and so is... https://stackoverflow.com/questions/12779914/error-expected-asm-or-attribute-before-token -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: Watch Mars landing this afternoon
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In reply to this post by gepr
I just think it kicks fucking ass that we have a robot on mars, to do some kick ass things. On Thu, Feb 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Jochen Fromm <[hidden email]> wrote:
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In reply to this post by jon zingale
perhaps, the wrong exchange. Better might be:
https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/20316/challenger-disaster-how-full-was-the-external-tank-at-the-time-of-destruction -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: Watch Mars landing this afternoon
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In reply to this post by jon zingale
I would think the metaphor is quite precise, since the same force that
distorts a commercial market place -- accrued power -- also distorts an academic one. I guess you might say -- I might say -- that when Sober publishes in a behavior journal, he is using his power in one domain -- philosophy of biology -- to tour in another. To make that case I would have to show that the argument he makes is not only shabby in behavioral terms, but no reason to claim that behavioral presuppositions are inconsistent with more general principles of science. A heavy lift? Nick Thompson [hidden email] https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -----Original Message----- From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of jon zingale Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 1:37 PM To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Watch Mars landing this afternoon Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify conceptual tourism? -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
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IDK, my joke response earlier was intended to say that I can't parse "market of ideas". A market requires some common measure (e.g. currency) to which everything is reduced and with which the things are bought and sold. If it's a market, what is that measure? You could make an argument that the measure need not be a reduction ... like some sort of barter. But there would still need to be some commonality, perhaps a language like English. And my guess is each idea domain has its own jargon, which implies the domains would all need to be inter-translatable ... and that would require some discussion of how isomorphic the languages are.
I'd argue part of why Nick thinks Sober is a tourist is because their languages don't match very well. Hence, either it's not a market or these 2 traders are bad at trading ... or somesuch. On 2/18/21 12:44 PM, [hidden email] wrote: > I would think the metaphor is quite precise, since the same force that > distorts a commercial market place -- accrued power -- also distorts an > academic one. I guess you might say -- I might say -- that when Sober > publishes in a behavior journal, he is using his power in one domain -- > philosophy of biology -- to tour in another. To make that case I would > have to show that the argument he makes is not only shabby in behavioral > terms, but no reason to claim that behavioral presuppositions are > inconsistent with more general principles of science. A heavy lift? > > Nick Thompson > [hidden email] > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of jon zingale > Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 1:37 PM > To: [hidden email] > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Watch Mars landing this afternoon > > Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an > efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify > conceptual tourism? -- ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
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Re: academia as a market of ideas
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Does ResearchGate offer anything like a currency with all its stats regarding publications and their reads, research interest, citations, etc? --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 2:29 PM uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ <[hidden email]> wrote: IDK, my joke response earlier was intended to say that I can't parse "market of ideas". A market requires some common measure (e.g. currency) to which everything is reduced and with which the things are bought and sold. If it's a market, what is that measure? You could make an argument that the measure need not be a reduction ... like some sort of barter. But there would still need to be some commonality, perhaps a language like English. And my guess is each idea domain has its own jargon, which implies the domains would all need to be inter-translatable ... and that would require some discussion of how isomorphic the languages are. - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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This is the currency! Nick Thompson https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Frank Wimberly Does ResearchGate offer anything like a currency with all its stats regarding publications and their reads, research interest, citations, etc? --- On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 2:29 PM uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: academia as a market of ideas
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So, yeah, I think I agree with Glen that there is something amiss about
claiming a *market of ideas*, but I am unconvinced that the notion misses completely. There is something like *instantaneous arbitrage* that happens across the space of ideas, a Laplacian that acts across disciplines, smoothing out and diffusing the wrinkles, and minimizing the collection of all technics that reside within the class that we might call the *state of the art*. As an example of itself, consider the conceptual technologies employed by this paper on arbitrage[⊽]: https://arxiv.org/abs/1509.03264. Ideas that originally found purchase in physical theory are lifted to speak about spaces most generally before finding new ground (and new interpretation) in a theory of differential value. The *state of the art* in physics meets the same in economics[Δ]. Arguably, tourism is to blame. On the other hand, while there is something unignorable to say about which ideas are valued more or less highly by academics, and most importantly, by the editors of journals[Æ], I feel that this pigeonhole leads the analogy astray. Instead, imagining that ideas once found are *free to all* and that the behavior with regards *low hanging fruit* is the interesting part of the analogy, an economy of ideas might be one where once differences can be exploited in one place they quickly find value throughout a network of resemblances. It is around this *state of the art* class of technics that one can imagine the space of ideas to be organized, that is, problems in one field are near problems in another if a need for the same or similar technics applies to both. Advances, then, in one produce a difference to exploit between the two. While this isn't 'price' explicitly, the space of ideas is haunted by something akin. Is it fair to say that there exists a kind of proto-economy around the world of ideas? [⊽] FWIW, I am tickled pink by constructions like, "...whose curvature measures...the 'instantaneous arbitrage capability' generated by the market itself. The cashflow bundle is the vector bundle associated to this stochastic principal fibre bundle for the natural choice of the vector space fibre". [Δ] As a third example, this afternoon I was thinking about an almost identical construction for reasoning about identity tracing in a world with time travel. Loosely, I am imagining that the simplexes formed by traveling to the past and waiting again for the present produces a difference in an 'individual that remains' not unlike curvature. [Æ] Let me not leave out the repositories of privatized knowledge that aim to simulate economic notions like scarcity, supply-and-demand, and the rest. -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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I contend that such a market (any market really, but this one more acutely I think) must have room for a rich commons to be healthy.
Perhaps the
biggest flaw in this formulation we are flirting with here is
that of "ideas as property"?
So, yeah, I think I agree with Glen that there is something amiss about claiming a *market of ideas*, but I am unconvinced that the notion misses completely. There is something like *instantaneous arbitrage* that happens across the space of ideas, a Laplacian that acts across disciplines, smoothing out and diffusing the wrinkles, and minimizing the collection of all technics that reside within the class that we might call the *state of the art*. As an example of itself, consider the conceptual technologies employed by this paper on arbitrage[⊽]: https://arxiv.org/abs/1509.03264. Ideas that originally found purchase in physical theory are lifted to speak about spaces most generally before finding new ground (and new interpretation) in a theory of differential value. The *state of the art* in physics meets the same in economics[Δ]. Arguably, tourism is to blame. On the other hand, while there is something unignorable to say about which ideas are valued more or less highly by academics, and most importantly, by the editors of journals[Æ], I feel that this pigeonhole leads the analogy astray. Instead, imagining that ideas once found are *free to all* and that the behavior with regards *low hanging fruit* is the interesting part of the analogy, an economy of ideas might be one where once differences can be exploited in one place they quickly find value throughout a network of resemblances. It is around this *state of the art* class of technics that one can imagine the space of ideas to be organized, that is, problems in one field are near problems in another if a need for the same or similar technics applies to both. Advances, then, in one produce a difference to exploit between the two. While this isn't 'price' explicitly, the space of ideas is haunted by something akin. Is it fair to say that there exists a kind of proto-economy around the world of ideas? [⊽] FWIW, I am tickled pink by constructions like, "...whose curvature measures...the 'instantaneous arbitrage capability' generated by the market itself. The cashflow bundle is the vector bundle associated to this stochastic principal fibre bundle for the natural choice of the vector space fibre". [Δ] As a third example, this afternoon I was thinking about an almost identical construction for reasoning about identity tracing in a world with time travel. Loosely, I am imagining that the simplexes formed by traveling to the past and waiting again for the present produces a difference in an 'individual that remains' not unlike curvature. [Æ] Let me not leave out the repositories of privatized knowledge that aim to simulate economic notions like scarcity, supply-and-demand, and the rest. -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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I believe we are in agreement here, though I did try to address this point
by claiming: "Instead, imagining that ideas once found are *free to all* and that the behavior with regards *low hanging fruit* is the interesting part of the analogy..." -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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In reply to this post by gepr
A "market" found in aboriginal Australia and the South Pacific:
1- the two sides never spoke, only one side was "in the market" at any given time. 2- side A put out piles of the goods(A) they wanted to trade then leave. 3- side B would place their trade goods(B) near the goods(A) they wished to purchase, then leave. 4-Side A would remove piles that had no goods(B) and factor the goods(A) piles into smaller lots, then leave. 5-Side B would add good(B) to the smaller good(A) piles. 4-5 would continue until there was no change in the good(A) and good(B) piles — indicating that X amount of Good(A) was worth Y amount of Good(B) No "commonality" of which glen speaks. Academia does not function as such a market, but I think FRIAM might. Lot's of ideas put out that attract no response while others spawn long threads. This is a kind of "valuation" of the original idea to others on the list. davew On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, at 2:29 PM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote: > IDK, my joke response earlier was intended to say that I can't parse > "market of ideas". A market requires some common measure (e.g. > currency) to which everything is reduced and with which the things are > bought and sold. If it's a market, what is that measure? You could make > an argument that the measure need not be a reduction ... like some sort > of barter. But there would still need to be some commonality, perhaps a > language like English. And my guess is each idea domain has its own > jargon, which implies the domains would all need to be > inter-translatable ... and that would require some discussion of how > isomorphic the languages are. > > I'd argue part of why Nick thinks Sober is a tourist is because their > languages don't match very well. Hence, either it's not a market or > these 2 traders are bad at trading ... or somesuch. > > On 2/18/21 12:44 PM, [hidden email] wrote: > > I would think the metaphor is quite precise, since the same force that > > distorts a commercial market place -- accrued power -- also distorts an > > academic one. I guess you might say -- I might say -- that when Sober > > publishes in a behavior journal, he is using his power in one domain -- > > philosophy of biology -- to tour in another. To make that case I would > > have to show that the argument he makes is not only shabby in behavioral > > terms, but no reason to claim that behavioral presuppositions are > > inconsistent with more general principles of science. A heavy lift? > > > > Nick Thompson > > [hidden email] > > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of jon zingale > > Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 1:37 PM > > To: [hidden email] > > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Watch Mars landing this afternoon > > > > Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an > > efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify > > conceptual tourism? > > -- > ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ > > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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I do think some commonality is required... the "rules of the
exchanges" are a shared language, albeit with a very restricted
lexicon. I also think that the relative valuation of trade-goods
is a key... there must be some asymmetry in valuation to "drive
the engine"... else there is no exchange where both A) and B) I have in my memory a possibly apocryphal or at least stylized/idealized variation as simple as:
This naturally continues until one or the other no longer feels
their exchanges are worthy or they run out of gifts to offer.
Assuming a large pool of gift-traders, Bob and Alice find Ted and
Carol and repeat, possibly regifting some of those they just
received. If both have been honest and earnest in their
gifting, then at worse Bob or Carol is out their perceived value
of the increment between the last gift, and if there is synergy
then both have a perceived increased value from their trades. I suppose one could consider this a parallel sorting algorithm with fuzzy (or contingent) values of the gifts implied. It seems as if it avoids (or minimizes) "Gift of the Magi" paradoxes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gift_of_the_Magi On 2/19/21 8:41 AM, Prof David West
wrote:
A "market" found in aboriginal Australia and the South Pacific: 1- the two sides never spoke, only one side was "in the market" at any given time. 2- side A put out piles of the goods(A) they wanted to trade then leave. 3- side B would place their trade goods(B) near the goods(A) they wished to purchase, then leave. 4-Side A would remove piles that had no goods(B) and factor the goods(A) piles into smaller lots, then leave. 5-Side B would add good(B) to the smaller good(A) piles. 4-5 would continue until there was no change in the good(A) and good(B) piles — indicating that X amount of Good(A) was worth Y amount of Good(B) No "commonality" of which glen speaks. Academia does not function as such a market, but I think FRIAM might. Lot's of ideas put out that attract no response while others spawn long threads. This is a kind of "valuation" of the original idea to others on the list. davew On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, at 2:29 PM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote:IDK, my joke response earlier was intended to say that I can't parse "market of ideas". A market requires some common measure (e.g. currency) to which everything is reduced and with which the things are bought and sold. If it's a market, what is that measure? You could make an argument that the measure need not be a reduction ... like some sort of barter. But there would still need to be some commonality, perhaps a language like English. And my guess is each idea domain has its own jargon, which implies the domains would all need to be inter-translatable ... and that would require some discussion of how isomorphic the languages are. I'd argue part of why Nick thinks Sober is a tourist is because their languages don't match very well. Hence, either it's not a market or these 2 traders are bad at trading ... or somesuch. On 2/18/21 12:44 PM, [hidden email] wrote:I would think the metaphor is quite precise, since the same force that distorts a commercial market place -- accrued power -- also distorts an academic one. I guess you might say -- I might say -- that when Sober publishes in a behavior journal, he is using his power in one domain -- philosophy of biology -- to tour in another. To make that case I would have to show that the argument he makes is not only shabby in behavioral terms, but no reason to claim that behavioral presuppositions are inconsistent with more general principles of science. A heavy lift? Nick Thompson [hidden email] https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -----Original Message----- From: Friam [hidden email] On Behalf Of jon zingale Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 1:37 PM To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Watch Mars landing this afternoon Speaking of efficiency, to what extent is it fair to consider academia an efficient market of ideas? To the degree that it is, would this justify conceptual tourism?-- ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/- .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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"there must be some asymmetry in valuation to *drive the engine*."
Perhaps, but must such a valuation be scalar-valued, orderable, or even comparable? The exchange of things seems sorting-algorithm-like but overall more shuffling-algorithm-like. For all of our differences, placing all of our goods outside our houses and permuting *like* things would effectively lead to no change. -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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Jon -
> "there must be some asymmetry in valuation to *drive the engine*." > > Perhaps, but must such a valuation be scalar-valued, orderable, or even > comparable? Agreed... > The exchange of things seems sorting-algorithm-like but overall > more shuffling-algorithm-like. I think that the presumption of trade is that participants *are* seeking to increase their perception of value of their "hoard". Trying to use the language you introduce above... I think I'm claiming that *local* orderability with no *global* orderability is what makes this work. Locality may apply to time as well as space/individual. My daughters at a certain age would return from a sleepover, having exchanged *their* dirty old sneakers for someone else's and *both* would apparently feel they had come away with a good deal. Perhaps the surplus value (in an otherwise presumed to be conserved valuation) came from each having increased some sort of friendship bond in the exchange, or perhaps it was just each pair of sneakers was "new" or "novel" to the other (most likely both). > For all of our differences, placing all of > our goods outside our houses and permuting *like* things would effectively > lead to no change. There was once a woman in El Dorado whose home was an artists-materials trove. She would scour garage sales and thrift stores for "objects of desire", especially things that could be transformed into collage, jewelry, multimedia, etc. She would carefully select, clean, smooth-out, package and price and generally "make precious" other people's junk. On a limited schedule and by appointment, local (and international actually) artists would visit her trove and buy items from her collection. After many years of this, she claimed that she no longer had to go out hunting and gathering because her local customers would bring her boxes of their discards and excess which she would "give the treatment" and others would then come and pay a premium for the sorting and preciousizing. In fact, she claimed she had friends who would return months later and buy their own items back simply because by sorting and bagging, she had made them precious again! I try to do this with the Habitat for Humanity restore. To avoid my own hoarding habits with building materials, I try to think of Habitat as a "storage location" and the price I pay to get my materials (or like/similar ones) back later is either a donation to a good cause, or a storage fee (or a little of both). In that vein, trading a 12' 2x6 for a 10' 2x4s is a bargain if I need a 10' 2x4 and the 2x6 is just taking up space awkwardly. Global/Local/Contextual valuation? > > > > -- > Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
Re: academia as a market of ideas
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"There was once a woman in El Dorado..."
I appreciate that you are introducing *the particular* into the discussion, exactly those things which escape symmetry. Additionally, she introduces *value* by means that escape direct valuation or rather is prior to evaluation. There is something about referring to her *treatment* that is reminiscent of the idea expressed in the *curried function* discussion we were having, something that I wish to reach for in responding to DaveW's: "...but I think FRIAM might. Lot's of ideas put out that attract no response while others spawn long threads." It may be the case that the value associated with the woman in El Dorado's *treatment* doesn't actualize, but instead *lies in wait*. Ideas seem much to me of this kind too, the value to me (as a seller) and value to the *market* need not instantaneously agree (arguably while preserving 'efficiency' in the market more generally). Again, I am very much a tourist here, economic thinking has never been natural to me. Recently, I reframed an Alphonse Mucha print that I have from 1901. It needed an archival frame and conservation glass. Not only do I not know about the relationship between the value of an object in a market versus its value to me, but I also do not know the former without probing for a buyer. What is the value of my investment in the archival framing of the Mucha? Maybe less ambiguous[1] would be the investments people put into their homes: new kitchens, decks, roof, etc... Much of the discussion around economics hover about the language of generality (equivalence, substitution, extension), but you bring up (as well as DaveW's aborigines) with the language of particulars, an idea very much worth developing. Still, that I feel this doesn't mean anything about the value Friam will give to the same. [1] Well almost, the housing market (or a bank) clearly values off-grid very differently than on-grid. I find it difficult to acquire loans for the off-grid, the particular. -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ |
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