The case for vegetarianism

[Marcus G. Daniels]

I was irritated as a 20 something with the existence of Python.   It wasn't any sense of ownership or investment in other things, just the sense that progress was being impeded by people not recognizing that there was already something serviceable.   If people run around making redundant inferior knock-offs, we will never have great things, because building great things requires cooperation and deep resourcing.  Improve the already great thing.

-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ?>$
Sent: Monday, June 14, 2021 10:25 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] The case for vegetarianism

Ha! I see what you did, there, flipping my rhetoric on its head. Can there be young vampires? I don't think so. (Anne Rice funged the genre! It's as ridiculous as fast/intelligent zombies.) I think we old vampires believe energy fades continuously. And even *if* there's a point where what we contribute drops below what we draw out, where that point lies is ambiguous. But the core assumption is the flawed one. Energy does not fade continuously. So, a 30 year old's contribution is not scaled linearly less than a 20 year old's contribution.

All 20 year olds contribute, even if it seems like their contribution is *distractive* from part of some partitioned space of tasks, as partitioned by some old vampire. The old vampires, by reinforcement learning, as their energy wanes, focus their energy and make arbitrary, meaningless, partitions and then harvest others' energy to route into their chosen partition. The benefit of the youth is that they bubble over with it, and don't need to ration it. And no amount of NAD+ boosters will overcome that!

So, it literally doesn't matter if they spend their energy reinventing the wheel. It does matter that we siphon off their energy and tell them to stop reinventing the wheel. If I hear another gray beard yap about punch cards one more time, I may snap. 8^D

On 6/14/21 10:06 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
> < But it *will* help, because it gets their skin in the game. Adds to
> the stew of energy we all feed off. And, as we covered before, it's
> not really energy, per se, but *free* energy that matters. Energy we
> old vampires can suck from the youth to live yet another day ... and
> redirect into our own convictions, our own paths to hell. >
>
> Are they adding energy or are they taking it?  The "well, I might as well kill myself" reflection is one that I think a lot of people just don't have.  And it is their defect.


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☤>$ uǝlƃ

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[gepr]

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[Marcus G. Daniels]

There is some correlation between individuals at generation G+1 and individuals at G.  If that correlation is low when on a dimension like the ability to notice the creep of authoritarianism, then there is a probably a cost to the free energy.   It seems cruel to expose generations of individuals to something like adolescence.    Vampirism is a business model that makes some sense.  Lurking in the background, occasionally taking some victim to keep that recessive gene, wisdom, etc. alive.  

-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ?>$
Sent: Monday, June 14, 2021 11:06 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] The case for vegetarianism

Sure. At 20, I was still irritated that Sammy Hagar had turned Van Halen into Van Hagar. If anything needed to kill itself, it was Van Halen in 1984. To each her own. 8^D But the admission that we can't ration[alize] our world perfectly has to keep percolating on the back burner. As our very tired conversation about epiphenomena points, you don't know for sure if Python was a redundant inferior knock-off or not ... any dorky posturing aside. Perhaps ML would not have reached today's heights if Python had never been discovered ... or, more importantly, perhaps ML would not be as democratized so that even a dolt like me can kindasorta do it.

Faith No More is an excellent example of avoiding premature suicide *and* remembering that one's convictions may turn out to be wrong. "I think, starting in 2009 or 2010, we did a month of shows where we just played. We played our old s*** and, look, that was really, really fun. But there's a shelf life on that, at least to us, and at one point we looked at each other, and we literally collectively said: "Okay ... is this it?" You know, we could go on playing that stuff maybe in Macedonia or whatever until the end of time. But we just looked at each other and said, "Nah. You know what? I think this is it unless we do new s***." That's when the surprise came to me that there actually was new s*** and stuff that I could chew on, but I was very skeptical." -- Mike Patton re: Sol Invictus

Uh oh. Am I now arguing that we should help the vampires live forever just in case they're carrying a recessive gene or somesuch? Bah.

On 6/14/21 10:35 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> I was irritated as a 20 something with the existence of Python.   It wasn't any sense of ownership or investment in other things, just the sense that progress was being impeded by people not recognizing that there was already something serviceable.   If people run around making redundant inferior knock-offs, we will never have great things, because building great things requires cooperation and deep resourcing.  Improve the already great thing.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ?>$
> Sent: Monday, June 14, 2021 10:25 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] The case for vegetarianism
>
> Ha! I see what you did, there, flipping my rhetoric on its head. Can there be young vampires? I don't think so. (Anne Rice funged the genre! It's as ridiculous as fast/intelligent zombies.) I think we old vampires believe energy fades continuously. And even *if* there's a point where what we contribute drops below what we draw out, where that point lies is ambiguous. But the core assumption is the flawed one. Energy does not fade continuously. So, a 30 year old's contribution is not scaled linearly less than a 20 year old's contribution.
>
> All 20 year olds contribute, even if it seems like their contribution is *distractive* from part of some partitioned space of tasks, as partitioned by some old vampire. The old vampires, by reinforcement learning, as their energy wanes, focus their energy and make arbitrary, meaningless, partitions and then harvest others' energy to route into their chosen partition. The benefit of the youth is that they bubble over with it, and don't need to ration it. And no amount of NAD+ boosters will overcome that!
>
> So, it literally doesn't matter if they spend their energy reinventing
> the wheel. It does matter that we siphon off their energy and tell
> them to stop reinventing the wheel. If I hear another gray beard yap
> about punch cards one more time, I may snap. 8^D
>
> On 6/14/21 10:06 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>> < But it *will* help, because it gets their skin in the game. Adds to
>> the stew of energy we all feed off. And, as we covered before, it's
>> not really energy, per se, but *free* energy that matters. Energy we
>> old vampires can suck from the youth to live yet another day ... and
>> redirect into our own convictions, our own paths to hell. >
>>
>> Are they adding energy or are they taking it?  The "well, I might as well kill myself" reflection is one that I think a lot of people just don't have.  And it is their defect.

--
☤>$ uǝlƃ

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