Score one for state-wide mandates (?)

[Steve Smith]

I was being my own example of the topic... uttering offended/offensive
words without any particular meaning or target... <sorry if I offended
you.. <grin>>

On 12/8/20 9:39 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> What offends you?   That I would point it is ridiculous (more so than offensive) to use the occasion of unease resulting from a viral infection to make a point about whether Consciousness exists?    I just think it is sad that Frank and Nick can't resolve this, because they've apparently been working on it so long.  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:36 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>
> That sh*t really offends me and I wish you would cut it the h*ell out!
> <whimper>
>
> On 12/8/20 9:20 AM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote:
>> Nicely circular! You don't have to know/believe the meaning of your words, for those words to have meaning. I'm particularly fond of how abusers will say something abhorrent, then act all surprised when victims take offense. The abuser often takes the stance that they were simply joking and the snowflake should grow a thicker skin. I'm as guilty as the rest.
>>
>> On 12/8/20 8:15 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>> I was kidding, of course.. believing the topic to be devoid of meaning, and so more absurd than abusive.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:09 AM
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>>
>>> It's important, even/especially for long-term partners, to reflect on possibly abusive habits. Even if the abused and the abuser *agree* that the habit isn't intentional abuse, an outsider will often *rightly* identify the habit as abusive.
>>>
>>> On 12/7/20 6:23 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>>>> If you agree that was mean please accept my sincere apologies.  I am hoping that you didn't find it so.  Marcus hasn't been privy to the hundreds of frank, sometimes humorous, in-person exchanges between us over the last 15+ years and I meant it in that spirit.
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[Marcus G. Daniels]

I have to say more than once in my life I have attempted to perform deconstruction of an anger state and made the subject more angry.    I suspect this procedure would result in a similar outcome for about 74 million other potential subjects.    "I am angry and you better not step in my anger field!"   "Why do you insensitively ignore my anger field?!"

-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:43 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery

I was being my own example of the topic... uttering offended/offensive words without any particular meaning or target... <sorry if I offended you.. <grin>>

On 12/8/20 9:39 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> What offends you?   That I would point it is ridiculous (more so than offensive) to use the occasion of unease resulting from a viral infection to make a point about whether Consciousness exists?    I just think it is sad that Frank and Nick can't resolve this, because they've apparently been working on it so long.  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:36 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>
> That sh*t really offends me and I wish you would cut it the h*ell out!
> <whimper>
>
> On 12/8/20 9:20 AM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote:
>> Nicely circular! You don't have to know/believe the meaning of your words, for those words to have meaning. I'm particularly fond of how abusers will say something abhorrent, then act all surprised when victims take offense. The abuser often takes the stance that they were simply joking and the snowflake should grow a thicker skin. I'm as guilty as the rest.
>>
>> On 12/8/20 8:15 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>> I was kidding, of course.. believing the topic to be devoid of meaning, and so more absurd than abusive.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:09 AM
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>>
>>> It's important, even/especially for long-term partners, to reflect on possibly abusive habits. Even if the abused and the abuser *agree* that the habit isn't intentional abuse, an outsider will often *rightly* identify the habit as abusive.
>>>
>>> On 12/7/20 6:23 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>>>> If you agree that was mean please accept my sincere apologies.  I am hoping that you didn't find it so.  Marcus hasn't been privy to the hundreds of frank, sometimes humorous, in-person exchanges between us over the last 15+ years and I meant it in that spirit.
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>

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[gepr]

Brilliant! This discussion perfectly exhibits the postmodern condition and the flaws of psychodynamic reasoning.

On 12/8/20 9:02 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> I have to say more than once in my life I have attempted to perform deconstruction of an anger state and made the subject more angry.    I suspect this procedure would result in a similar outcome for about 74 million other potential subjects.    "I am angry and you better not step in my anger field!"   "Why do you insensitively ignore my anger field?!"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:43 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>
> I was being my own example of the topic... uttering offended/offensive words without any particular meaning or target... <sorry if I offended you.. <grin>>
>
> On 12/8/20 9:39 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>> What offends you?   That I would point it is ridiculous (more so than offensive) to use the occasion of unease resulting from a viral infection to make a point about whether Consciousness exists?    I just think it is sad that Frank and Nick can't resolve this, because they've apparently been working on it so long.  
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:36 AM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>
>> That sh*t really offends me and I wish you would cut it the h*ell out!
>> <whimper>
>>
>> On 12/8/20 9:20 AM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote:
>>> Nicely circular! You don't have to know/believe the meaning of your words, for those words to have meaning. I'm particularly fond of how abusers will say something abhorrent, then act all surprised when victims take offense. The abuser often takes the stance that they were simply joking and the snowflake should grow a thicker skin. I'm as guilty as the rest.
>>>
>>> On 12/8/20 8:15 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>>> I was kidding, of course.. believing the topic to be devoid of meaning, and so more absurd than abusive.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:09 AM
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>>>
>>>> It's important, even/especially for long-term partners, to reflect on possibly abusive habits. Even if the abused and the abuser *agree* that the habit isn't intentional abuse, an outsider will often *rightly* identify the habit as abusive.
>>>>
>>>> On 12/7/20 6:23 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>>>>> If you agree that was mean please accept my sincere apologies.  I am hoping that you didn't find it so.  Marcus hasn't been privy to the hundreds of frank, sometimes humorous, in-person exchanges between us over the last 15+ years and I meant it in that spirit.

--
↙↙↙ uǝlƃ

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[Steve Smith]

Marcus -

I like your image of an "anger field" and in fact the interpenetration
of two (or many really, but identifiably two) anger-fields operating in
many ways like an estuary...  I lived a great deal of my life in a
cultural estuary and feel that I have benefited significantly from the
complex gradients I've been left to swim in.   It makes me want to
update John Wesley Powell's ideas of "thinking like a watershed" to
"being like an estuary".  

I also find the abstraction of stigmergy to apply... MAGA Hats and
Diesel Dually Pickups (with Truck Nuts and tuned to "Roll Coal" on
demand) are just a couple of the residuals laid down.   Of course, 72M
people (or a big subset of them) see things like haute couture labeled
clothing (Louise Vuitton or REI), COVID masks, and hybrid or electric
cars to be the same.  

I dunno if this kind of framing/analysis helps anyone (even me), except
maybe soothing/distracting my Id from it's constant cage (or sabre?)
rattling..

- Steve

> I have to say more than once in my life I have attempted to perform deconstruction of an anger state and made the subject more angry.    I suspect this procedure would result in a similar outcome for about 74 million other potential subjects.    "I am angry and you better not step in my anger field!"   "Why do you insensitively ignore my anger field?!"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:43 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>
> I was being my own example of the topic... uttering offended/offensive words without any particular meaning or target... <sorry if I offended you.. <grin>>
>
> On 12/8/20 9:39 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>> What offends you?   That I would point it is ridiculous (more so than offensive) to use the occasion of unease resulting from a viral infection to make a point about whether Consciousness exists?    I just think it is sad that Frank and Nick can't resolve this, because they've apparently been working on it so long.  
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Steve Smith
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:36 AM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>
>> That sh*t really offends me and I wish you would cut it the h*ell out!
>> <whimper>
>>
>> On 12/8/20 9:20 AM, uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote:
>>> Nicely circular! You don't have to know/believe the meaning of your words, for those words to have meaning. I'm particularly fond of how abusers will say something abhorrent, then act all surprised when victims take offense. The abuser often takes the stance that they were simply joking and the snowflake should grow a thicker skin. I'm as guilty as the rest.
>>>
>>> On 12/8/20 8:15 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>>> I was kidding, of course.. believing the topic to be devoid of meaning, and so more absurd than abusive.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 8:09 AM
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Recovery
>>>>
>>>> It's important, even/especially for long-term partners, to reflect on possibly abusive habits. Even if the abused and the abuser *agree* that the habit isn't intentional abuse, an outsider will often *rightly* identify the habit as abusive.
>>>>
>>>> On 12/7/20 6:23 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>>>>> If you agree that was mean please accept my sincere apologies.  I am hoping that you didn't find it so.  Marcus hasn't been privy to the hundreds of frank, sometimes humorous, in-person exchanges between us over the last 15+ years and I meant it in that spirit.
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>> http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
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>>
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>

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