Santa Fe's Sugar Tax
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For the FRIAMers in Santa Fe who might be interested in the sugar-tax vote....
There's an interesting issue coming up on a May 2nd city ballot here in Santa Fe: Whether the city can tax drinks with sugar. I may have a short letter running in The New Mexican this week, but here is the link to "Sugar Tax initiative built with a faulty scaffold" http://tiny.cc/SugarTaxOpEd TJ ============================================ Tom Johnson Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA 505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h) Society of Professional Journalists Check out It's The People's Data ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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As someone that's currently...Financially Challenged. All this crap adds up, and as you note it's to easy to interpert how you want. For example: I am (famously?) a tea lover. I love all kinds of tea, medically helpful, just fun etc. Why do I mention that? How likely would they decide my 2-3buck honey that makes fucking awsome mid afternoon tea that's refreshing suddenly jump to 4-5 dollars? Well 5 bucks to me Besides if they REELY want free kick ass education (Great please PLEASE do) Their might be better ways to go. Grocery stores (looking at you smiths) charge out the ass for healthy fun to eat food.For example ERMG It's so fun and nice to have fruits(Grapes and strawberries) that in my famly I'm infamously for loving. Thouse have sugers in them that are good for you(no idea how that works).As you point out the wording leaves it open to the Martinez's of the world to say: gee that 2buck a bag of graps is now I duno 5bucks! for those keeping tabs that'd be a tank of gas between the honey and fruits. Ouch. I'm skeptical yet another tax will help anything. Nickle and diming people does very little to help anyone. And frankly just makes people mad and wonder where all that's going. I wholy agree Santa Fe needs a fun kick ass research school And have tried to make one twice going on third go. The poloticing around education in this city and state like I said to Edd and You made me wonder if I was on drugs LOL Or maybe they were. Sufficed to say I doubt this'll help. Their needs to be a plan and the city definatly needs to do somethings to bring in money. I'm just skeptical this is the way to go. On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 12:30 PM, Tom Johnson <[hidden email]> wrote:
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The issue is refined sugars added into products, Gil. I'm sure your grapes and strawberries are safe. T. ============================================ Tom Johnson Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA 505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h) Society of Professional Journalists Check out It's The People's Data On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 1:54 PM, Gillian Densmore <[hidden email]> wrote:
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In reply to this post by Gillian Densmore
Gil- For what it is worth, I recommend that you buy local honey from a
local beekeeper, probably off the books, not subject to sugar (or
any other kind of) tax. It will be much healthier for you (the
local pollens help with allergies, etc.) and will support a local
economy well beyond the $.02 that goes back into the local economy
for any $1.00 you might spend at a supermarket (even one as
folksy/homey as Trader Joes). There are also locally grown
raspberries and strawberries and even grapes (in season) and lots
of fruits (cherry, peach, apricot, plum, apples. pears)... And as
much as I like my year round bounty of fresh fruits and veggies
imported from around the world (with gawd knows how much
inefficiency and product waste/spoilage) it is possible that we
(of northern Euro descent?) were evolved for a diet that varies
with what is available and might be healthier not to have the same
continuous access to foods rich flavor/fat/sugar year round? The catch is that you will probably pay as much for all these as
you would for the "sugar-taxed" versions shipped in from another
hemisphere with artificial economies and hidden costs to the
environment and society. But the extra will go to your friends
and neighbor's who are trying to make a living instead of
Martinez's warchest or whatever might be offensive about all
this. While I'm not big on government interference in matters such as
this, it might just be that it all balances out and rebalances the
false economies of subsidized (cheap oil/war) transportation and
third-world labor/production. Maybe in these Trumpian times I'm
just looking for Silver linings and new recipes for Lemonade from
Lemons? Or living a PollyAnna/PanGlossian delusion. Just Sayin' - Steve PS. Next time I get a jar of honey from my local apiarist, I'll grab you one "on the house".
On 4/25/17 1:54 PM, Gillian Densmore
wrote:
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Steve wrote: "...And as much as I like my year round bounty of fresh fruits and veggies imported from around the world (with gawd knows how much inefficiency and product waste/spoilage)" George Duncan and I were in Sri Lanka in January. We stopped at a highway produce stand in the interior part of the island. There for sale were small Red Delicious apples, the type typically seen in our stores. Those apples were imported from Washington State. Each apple was priced at the equivalent of 50 cents, about what we pay here. So how does that work? TJ ============================================ Tom Johnson Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA 505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h) Society of Professional Journalists Check out It's The People's Data On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 3:38 PM, Steven A Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
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In reply to this post by Tom Johnson
I fully agree adding junk to food is a foods is a issue. I am just concerned their might be (hopefuly) better ways to bring desperatly needed funds to NM. I just wonder if there's a better way to go about fixing that problem, and try to encourage people to enjoy a healthyER life style. I am also (I hope) reasonably skeptical basically taxing fake food and soda is the way to go. Do we reely need yet another potentially misguided tax? @My example heh, Point taken, I was just using a silly example of why that might not work. On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 2:28 PM, Tom Johnson <[hidden email]> wrote:
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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In reply to this post by Tom Johnson
Maybe I'm just a curmudgeon ("get off my lawn!") but I'd say it *doesn't*... the illusion that it does is probably hugely implicated in our current global-scale crises (climate, poverty, pestilence, bad made-for-TV-movies, and halitosis). A more direct (less ranty/sociopolitical) answer might be that container shipping and modern preservation techniques and an imbalance of trade, and agricultural surpluses resulting from mega-AG in the US probably help to make this possible. For example, if there is a net trade surplus in container count going from Sri Lanka (or nearby) to the US, then filling containers with Red Delish (you said they were small, maybe sub-par for our self-indulgent markets?) and shipping them back is somewhere between free and highly subsidized by whatever product (scarcifying rain-forest hardwoods? Nike Sneakers?) is being shipped *this* way. I suspect a fully loaded container ship *is* a little more expensive to push across the Pacific but maybe only by a small increment? Then we have the difference in currency/wages/standard of living and in the US, that $.50 apple would net the seller $.25 or less here, but in Sri Lanka that might be an hour's wages for the people unloading/grading/packaging/delivering/retailing in Sri Lanka? I'm sure someone has studied and written up lots about this somewhere... maybe a Journalist? Economist? Social Commentarian? Is this world perhaps on the cusp of a punctuation mark in the proverbial "punctuated equilibrium"? Will we have something like a thermal inversion where all these false economies turn back right side up? Or is this the "curmudgeon" in me thinking it is "wrong-side up". I suppose there are (Panglossian?) arguments to be made: "all is for the best" in the "best of all possible worlds". I hear this from many of my Trumpian friends (on topics like climate change denial, misogyny, etc.) - Steve ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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I think one of the useful arguments in this vein is the one often lobbed against the concept of a free market. There is no such thing; and there will/can never be such a thing. So, your question seems to assume there is a "true" economy by comparison to the "false" economies (or an upside right one vs an upside down one). What makes you _believe_ ... where lies your faith in true or upside right economies? Maybe your Utopian homunculus has broken free of its chains? This is, I think, different from the "best of all possible world"... It's more like a rejection of a stable landscape. There are no optima ... or perhaps all optima are local (in time, space, and sub-graph)? On 04/25/2017 03:22 PM, Steven A Smith wrote: > Will we have something like a thermal inversion where all these false economies turn back right side up? Or is this the "curmudgeon" in me thinking it is "wrong-side up". I suppose there are (Panglossian?) arguments to be made: "all is for the best" in the "best of all possible worlds <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_of_all_possible_worlds>". I hear this from many of my Trumpian friends (on topics like climate change denial, misogyny, etc.) -- ☣ glen ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
uǝʃƃ ⊥ glen
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Could we get back to Tom's OP? I for one am a "no" vote for exactly Tom's reasons.
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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Me, too, Joe. On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 10:42 AM, Joe Spinden <[hidden email]> wrote:
Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA Visiting Professor in Integrative Peacebuilding Saint Paul University Ottawa, Ontario, Canada ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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In reply to this post by Owen Densmore
Am I the only one who smells Elitist? After all, it won't impact US!
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Nobody seems to focus on the educational results which, I hope, are entailed by the bill. I don’t care about the tax or how much sugar I consume but everyone will benefit from wider access to pre-K. Speaking of elitist, most of my friends are my age peers and have no young children in their lives currently. I live with our five-year old grandson. Also, I just got a flyer that makes the following points: 1. Kids who attend pre-K score higher in reading and math; are more likely to graduate from high school. [Possible hidden common cause] 2. Pre-K for SF will create 200 jobs. 3. Low income families will benefit the most. Private pre-K costs 12000-16000 per year. [so it’s non-elitist] 4. The revenue will only be used for pre-K by ordinance. 5. The City budget surplus comes and goes. Pre-K is a recurring expense. [] = my observation Frank Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz Santa Fe, NM 87505 Phone: (505) 995-8715 Cell: (505) 670-9918 From: Friam [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Marcus Daniels Joe writes: “It is Elitist to be in favor of something that promotes general health?” It is elitist to burden your neighbors’ pocketbook by pushing for law to promote general health AND is it is elitist to not care about your neighbors’ health! Damned elitists! Marcus ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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Frank writes: “I don’t care about the tax or how much sugar I consume but everyone will benefit from wider access to pre-K. Speaking of elitist, most of my friends are my age peers and have no young children in their lives currently.” Everyone except your friends.
Marcus ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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Well, I'm hoping that better education is associated with lower poverty and crime. But I suppose that my friends and I will be deceased or oblivious by the time today's preschoolers are old enough to be criminals. Frank Frank Wimberly Phone (505) 670-9918 On Apr 27, 2017 4:21 PM, "Marcus Daniels" <[hidden email]> wrote:
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove |
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