Pragmaticism and puritanism

[thompnickson2]

Glen,

Beans and rice, yes.

Studies that show that research groups that have a philosopher on call produce better research than those that do not, yes.

Nick

Nicholas Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
Clark University
[hidden email]
https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
 


-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of u?l? ?
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 12:18 PM
To: FriAM <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Pragmaticism and puritanism

No. Go to the meeting. Follow Frank's advice. And stop at the store on the way home to buy some beans and rice.

I don't care at all about what philosophers might say about philosophers' contributions to science. That's the point. I need to see some *scientific* studies of whether conversations like this contribute to science. That's what I mean by eating your own dog food. If you claim to privilege science, then actually cite or do some science.


On 3/11/20 11:00 AM, [hidden email] wrote:

> Re Renee:  If she were the Friam Health Officer, would she suspend our weekly meeting of septuagenarians in a college dining hall?  For her information, there are exactly zero diagnosed cases of the virus in NM at the moment.
>
> I agree with you.  It’s certainly not death I fear.  Its that moment when Penny and I are crawling to the front door to gnaw at boxes of sugar frosted flakes that the fire department has left at our door.  That moment I fear.
>
> [...]
>
> */[NST===>] No, no, Glen.  Be fair.  That’s OUR dogfood I would be
> eating.  So the question would be, Does a science move more slowly or
> more rapidly toward convergence on enduring understandings with or
> without logical understandings?  Can philosophers point to cases where
> they have clearly contributed to development and/or dissemination of
> empirical knowledge?  I know that many philosophers of science have
> been dubious about it. .  I would quickly cite Peirce as an example
> given that his focus on the practicial consequences of concepts (their
> consequences in practice) helped to move behavioral sciences on during
> subsequent 50 years. Somebody must of made that case.  I will shake
> some bushes.  /*

--
☣ uǝlƃ

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[Marcus G. Daniels]

There are some plausible epitopes to target in a vaccine (Table 3).   While Trump is shaking hands with people, maybe Biden will have the presence of mind to give it away?   Announcement tomorrow, will be interesting to hear what he has to say.

https://www.mdpi.com/1999-4915/12/3/254/htm

On 3/11/20, 11:58 AM, "Friam on behalf of uǝlƃ ☣" <[hidden email] on behalf of [hidden email]> wrote:

   
    https://www.google.com/search?q=personal+genome+machine&client=firefox-b-1-d&source=lnms&tbm=shop&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiJxu6tjJPoAhUWvJ4KHbYoA8oQ_AUoA3oECA0QBQ&biw=1608&bih=861
   
   
    On 3/11/20 11:43 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
    > Maybe a DIYbio project is needed to deploy sequencing machines all over the place.   It seems crazy the US is so backward on this, with so much technology available to do surveillance.
   
   
    --
    ☣ uǝlƃ
   
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[Steve Smith]

I'm thinking the symptoms of COVID19 might be closer to those of a
"dodgy drug" in this case...  some fever dreams for all who are symptomatic?

On 3/11/20 11:01 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> Temporary refrigeration for some FRIAM members?  Just until it all blows over?  
>
> On 3/11/20, 9:30 AM, "Friam on behalf of [hidden email]" <[hidden email] on behalf of [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>     Hi Dave,
>    
>     Well, at the very least, the kind of information that would convince me to take a somewhat dodgy drug to fend off covid19.  
>    
>     N
>    
>     Nicholas Thompson
>     Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
>     Clark University
>     [hidden email]
>     https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
>      
>    
>    
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Prof David West
>     Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 9:05 AM
>     To: [hidden email]
>     Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Pragmaticism and puritanism
>    
>     May I add — what would convince you that psychedelic experiences are worth of the same kind of investigation as "ordinary" experiences.
>    
>     davew
>    
>    
>     On Wed, Mar 11, 2020, at 3:18 PM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote:
>     > Well, I definitely privilege scientific ways of knowing more than any
>     > other way of knowing [†]. So I don't disagree with what you *say*. But
>     > it seems to me that *you* don't privilege scientific knowledge in
>     > these discussions. You talk a LOT about philosophy and metaphysics,
>     > but not much about scientific results. The recent 'round and 'round
>     > about "sledgehammers", Peirce's metaphysics, or whatnot, largely
>     > ignoring any attempts to discuss psychedelic research and medicine,
>     > seems to imply that you do not privilege science.
>     >
>     > So, maybe if I pull out the old saw again?  If results published in
>     > peer-reviewed literature and clinical trial data will NOT convince you
>     > that psychedelics can be used as medicine, then what WOULD convince
>     > you? If nothing will ever convince you, then you certainly do NOT
>     > privilege science.
>     >
>     >
>     > [†] It ain't perfect; and it ain't the only kind of knowledge. But
>     > it's the best we have.
>     >
>     > On 3/10/20 11:03 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>     > > No, I am not sure that Dave and Glen would disagree with any of this.
>     >
>     > --
>     > ☣ uǝlƃ
>     >
>     > ============================================================
>     > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe
>     > at St. John's College to unsubscribe
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>     >
>    
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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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