Friam

Another COVID remedy?

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Steve Smith

Another COVID remedy?

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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Gary Schiltz-4

Re: Another COVID remedy?

Oh boy, that's sure to get some flames going! Even reasonably social beings like myself cringe at the thought of "people could take a substance to boost their cooperative, pro-social behavior." Social engineering writ large. Maybe it would work in China or other countries that have a very high opinion of working for the common good, but I think we're many generations away from such an idea working in the USA.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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thompnickson2

Re: Another COVID remedy?

I dunno. Do you cringe at taking a drug that would increase your assertiveness and sexual interest? Do you cringe at taking a drug that diminishes non productive rumination and makes you more proactive? Mind you, I am NOT asking you if you take such drugs, but whether you cringe at the thought of taking them.

Nicholas Thompson

Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology

Clark University

[hidden email]

https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Gary Schiltz
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 5:40 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Another COVID remedy?

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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Gary Schiltz-4

Re: Another COVID remedy?

I cringe at the thought of society or its government forcing or coercing me to do so.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 7:02 PM <[hidden email]> wrote:

I dunno. Do you cringe at taking a drug that would increase your assertiveness and sexual interest? Do you cringe at taking a drug that diminishes non productive rumination and makes you more proactive? Mind you, I am NOT asking you if you take such drugs, but whether you cringe at the thought of taking them.

N

Nicholas Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
Clark University
[hidden email]
https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Gary Schiltz
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 5:40 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Another COVID remedy?

Oh boy, that's sure to get some flames going! Even reasonably social beings like myself cringe at the thought of "people could take a substance to boost their cooperative, pro-social behavior." Social engineering writ large. Maybe it would work in China or other countries that have a very high opinion of working for the common good, but I think we're many generations away from such an idea working in the USA.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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Steve Smith

Re: Another COVID remedy?

In reply to this post by Gary Schiltz-4

I know... I was too lazy to look up the tongue-in-cheek emoticon :^) . I think it is more likely that we will all be willing to fly on pilotless airliners (or amongst driverless semis) than to submit to morality-altering substances. If I was really evil, I would suggest that big Pharma was in cahoots with the Moral Majority to slip this into the alternatives to Vaxxines that half the population is going to refuse on "moral" grounds.

Oh boy, that's sure to get some flames going! Even reasonably social beings like myself cringe at the thought of "people could take a substance to boost their cooperative, pro-social behavior." Social engineering writ large. Maybe it would work in China or other countries that have a very high opinion of working for the common good, but I think we're many generations away from such an idea working in the USA.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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Steve Smith

Re: Another COVID remedy?

In reply to this post by thompnickson2

On 8/14/20 6:02 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

I dunno. Do you cringe at taking a drug that would increase your assertiveness and sexual interest? Do you cringe at taking a drug that diminishes non productive rumination and makes you more proactive? Mind you, I am NOT asking you if you take such drugs, but whether you cringe at the thought of taking them.

I have never been a tobacco smoker/nicotine addict but among those I knew when it was common/en-vogue and the few who remain, it looks to me like a universal drug with primarily positive side-effects (excepting emphysema, cancer, heart disease, but those are always "way down the road"). Nicotine "picks you up when you are down", "levels you off when you are anxious", "helps you wake up", "helps put you to sleep", "pairs well with a good meal", "suppresses hunger ", "sharpens your mind", etc.!!!

When the townfolk were up in arms with torches and pitchforks against smoking (indoor public spaces, then outdoor public spaces, then anywhere/everywehere) I used to joke with them that when they got done with the evil tobacco, they could start in on another widely used evil substance... one that you could also smell throughout the house when anyone prepared it, one that also gives you strong-smelling breath, one that also stains your teeth... etc. which of course is the good ole coffee/caffeine. Virtually none of them saw the spoof coming and all of them were deeply offended that I would compare the two... and yet ...

I'm convinced (with virtually no evidence) that our two 2020 candidates are both running on a much more sophisticated cocktail of pharmacuties than JFK is reputed to have been dosed with by HIS personal doc regularly. How many lines of Adderall does each candidate snort before the debate to "sharpen up"? Maybe *that* could be the opening scene at the debates instead of a coin-toss? Biden seems to keep a modest exercise schedule which has the charm of adjusting body/brain chemistry toward the "helpful", But then a cheeseburger and a Tweetstorm can be pretty stimulating to some folks too!

N

Nicholas Thompson

Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology

Clark University

[hidden email]

https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam [hidden email] On Behalf Of Gary Schiltz
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 5:40 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Another COVID remedy?

Oh boy, that's sure to get some flames going! Even reasonably social beings like myself cringe at the thought of "people could take a substance to boost their cooperative, pro-social behavior." Social engineering writ large. Maybe it would work in China or other countries that have a very high opinion of working for the common good, but I think we're many generations away from such an idea working in the USA.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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Steve Smith

Re: Another COVID remedy?

In reply to this post by Gary Schiltz-4

I cringe at the thought of society or its government forcing or coercing me to do so.

I'm really just stirring the pot here. I agree with your spirit entirely, nevertheless, the US military once included cigarettes and coffee (still do Coffee) in rations, and even issued Benzadrine for night-missions or long-haul-fatigueing missions. Who knows what they do nowdays... I understand (way too acutely) that a citizen in military service is in many ways no longer a citizen, or temporarily not a full citizen.

I grew up in an era and locale where recreational drug use *was* prescribed by my (sub) culture. I struggled more than a little with my own preference to remain (mostly) unaltered through my young adulthood. I restricted myself to (usually) modest use of alcohol and caffeine to meet the "ups and downs" of life, but was often socially denigrated or excluded for not imbibing in the full range of "whatever was in vogue at the time". I was careful not to openly judge other's choices in those matters, which muted the exclusion somewhat, but I felt *very* coerced by the subculture of the 70's youth and watched more than a few peers fall into one "hole" or another, although usually only temporarily (blew a semester or two of college, or a few grade points, or a job, or a circle of friends, or a spouse).

I'm not *personally* wound up by the government-mandated (or at least backed/encouraged) additives like flouride in water systems, iodine in salt, VitD in milk, etc. ad nauseum. But some are (quite acutely). I think the use of lead as an anti pre-ignition additive in gasoline was (at least in retrospect) a horrific crime against a whole generation (especially those living in dense urban areas).

Maybe I should move to the highlands of Ecuador! <grin>

- Steve

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 7:02 PM <[hidden email]> wrote:

I dunno. Do you cringe at taking a drug that would increase your assertiveness and sexual interest? Do you cringe at taking a drug that diminishes non productive rumination and makes you more proactive? Mind you, I am NOT asking you if you take such drugs, but whether you cringe at the thought of taking them.

N

Nicholas Thompson

Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology

Clark University

[hidden email]

https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Gary Schiltz
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 5:40 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Another COVID remedy?

Oh boy, that's sure to get some flames going! Even reasonably social beings like myself cringe at the thought of "people could take a substance to boost their cooperative, pro-social behavior." Social engineering writ large. Maybe it would work in China or other countries that have a very high opinion of working for the common good, but I think we're many generations away from such an idea working in the USA.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 5:09 PM Steve Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/morality-pills-may-be-the-uss-best-shot-at-ending-the-coronavirus-pandemic-according-to-one-ethicist-142601

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